[3.2s - 9.1s] Awesome. Awesome. Okay, so yeah, Shally, you know, I read that, you know, you've been working
[9.8s - 16.6s] in this industry like since you're 11 years old. Was that like actually like you actually
[16.6s - 20.2s] started like in this industry or like you started working at that age?
[20.6s - 27.8s] No, I started working at that age. I, my parents had some different businesses, you know,
[27.8s - 32.2s] back when the word entrepreneur was anything, my dad was definitely a serial entrepreneur.
[33.1s - 38.9s] So I get exposed to working early and being in the in a family owned business early, but
[38.9s - 42.8s] my current business, I've been in, I've been in business for a couple of decades, but
[43.4s - 48.7s] I've been in the culture, the leadership, the workplace space for gosh, almost four decades
[48.7s - 55.5s] now. Got it, got it, got it. And then I got to ask like in the early stages for you, which
[55.5s - 62.2s] was very early in your life when you got into entrepreneurship between like restaurant
[62.2s - 65.0s] auction and like flea market, which one was your favorite?
[66.1s - 73.4s] You know what, it was fun to go out on the flea market side and collect, I was very young.
[73.8s - 79.6s] So my little, you know, pocket bag going out to collect the fees, but then those people
[79.6s - 84.2s] would come into the restaurant when the auction was going off. And I could hear the auction
[84.8s - 90.5s] happening while we were serving breakfast and lunch. And so it was fun. It was hard work.
[90.5s - 94.5s] I didn't like having to get up at four o'clock in the morning in order to be there because
[94.5s - 99.9s] people set up early, but it was fun. It probably wasn't fun then, but as I look back, it
[99.9s - 105.7s] was so many things that formed who I am and how I think and just the exposure of people.
[106.1s - 113.1s] So got it, got it. Well, what do you mean by in terms of like how you think it has an
[113.1s - 113.7s] effect on that?
[114.6s - 124.3s] Yeah, I just realized how different people showed up and organized their space into how different.
[125.1s - 129.0s] So there were people who had vegetables, you know, set up. So it was kind of like the
[129.0s - 137.5s] farmers market piece into what you think about in a not just the auction house space, but
[137.5s - 141.7s] people just getting rid of miscellaneous things. And then some things were new. It was interesting
[141.7s - 148.1s] to hear people sell. It's people with walk up. And it was a lot of fun hearing people bid
[148.1s - 152.6s] on things and just how they would go through and look at things. So the auction house versus
[152.6s - 159.7s] the flea market side, it was just a very diverse group of individuals that came. And again,
[159.9s - 166.0s] as I reflect back, I think about how different people reacted to the pushy salesman versus
[166.0s - 171.1s] the casual conversation. And then I remember my mom and dad are always talking about life is
[171.1s - 176.0s] about who you know and how you show up and relationships and everything is selling and
[176.0s - 181.6s] influencing. And so when I look back and I started talking and being a manager myself,
[182.2s - 187.4s] I started hearing my mom and dad's words come out. And then I thought about all the times
[187.4s - 193.2s] that either I was awkward or I saw people trying to sell things or to buy things and get
[193.2s - 200.3s] happy, sad, glad. So that whole, probably the emotional intelligence and how people created
[200.3s - 205.3s] trust amongst each other, I learned that and didn't realize it with learning it when I learned it.
[205.3s - 211.3s] Does that make sense? That makes sense. That makes perfect sense. Yeah, no, for sure. And I can
[211.3s - 218.2s] also relate myself to some things like when certain things parents, my mom used to say
[218.2s - 225.2s] over and over again and then it took me a while to get it to click. So, and speaking of
[225.2s - 230.9s] that as you're mentioning, some of the things that your dad needs to say once somewhere you
[230.9s - 237.0s] said that your dad needs to say that you should never work for someone else. And it took
[237.0s - 246.7s] 25 years to listen to that advice. Yes, yes. Yeah, again, it's one of those, oh, moments.
[247.1s - 251.3s] It's, you know, we're all driven by different things and motivated by different things and
[251.3s - 256.0s] some people are more comfortable being a part of and, you know, being a part of the collective
[256.0s - 260.7s] and then some people want to kind of set their tone, their charge. So it doesn't mean that
[260.7s - 266.8s] one is good or bad. It's just, you know, kind of how we are. And my dad was more of an
[267.8s - 273.0s] out of the box thinker and the what if and the why not. And he clearly saw that in me too
[273.0s - 278.1s] because I questioned everything. And then my mom was more of she was the organized person.
[278.2s - 283.2s] She was the process, the precision, the flow, the behind the scenes, the stability. So, you
[283.2s - 290.9s] know, you need to have both. And I understood that if I needed the freedom and the ability and
[290.9s - 296.5s] the control and the what if and the why not, that I needed to be the person making those
[296.5s - 301.1s] ultimate decisions, good, bad, or indifferent. And so he was right, but it took me a while to
[301.1s - 301.5s] get there.
[302.5s - 306.9s] God, I got it. Would you do you consider yourself like one or the other side where he said,
[306.9s - 310.4s] like mom was the, you know, organized precision, you know, side?
[311.4s - 316.5s] I'm definitely more on the innovation and agility side, the what if and the why not. I am, I
[316.5s - 322.7s] will not say I'm overly organized. I've intentionally hired people to help me with the organization
[322.7s - 327.0s] and to fill in the blanks, you know, where where I'm not. My mom had actually both of my
[327.0s - 332.2s] parents at past, but I still find myself going, I know mom would know where that would
[332.2s - 337.0s] be. Like where did she put it? Cause she was so organized. So yeah, not my zone of genius.
[337.2s - 342.5s] My zone of genius is create a problem solving and the vision and the strategy to help people
[342.5s - 346.7s] get there. And then I can lay out, you know, the steps and I can get down on the weeds,
[347.0s - 349.2s] but that is not my preferred cadence.
[349.2s - 359.2s] It's got to go. Makes sense. So you spent 14 years at Maria, you know, with the hotel
[359.2s - 364.4s] franchises before you starting a premier report. So, you know, when you look back, like
[364.4s - 369.5s] of all the corporate experience that you've had, what was the moment you'd say when you
[369.5s - 373.5s] started realize that, okay, certain things in the workplace is kind of broken when it
[373.5s - 377.0s] comes to culture, etc. Which basically became your life's work.
[377.8s - 382.9s] Yeah, that's a great question. So when I was with Marriott for 14 years, very structure.
[383.3s - 388.7s] They definitely reinforced the foundation and I lived in Bury that employees were first.
[389.1s - 393.6s] If you take care of the employees, everything else flows. And so they definitely walked
[393.6s - 397.6s] the talk. I remember, you know, I'm definitely dating myself, but when Mr. Marriott would
[397.6s - 404.3s] come on site, how we would line up to greet him and how he was super personable, but
[404.3s - 411.9s] he saw, you know, all the details. So I got more of my need for systems and structure and
[411.9s - 416.4s] consistency in those years. And then as I moved the next eight years into the franchise
[416.4s - 424.8s] side on the hotel business, that's where the disengagement and the realization of the importance
[424.8s - 431.2s] of what we call culture. And so I became very disengaged. I was with a franchise partner
[431.2s - 438.5s] that had eight hotels, groomed to 32 hotels, a variety of different flags. And I became
[438.5s - 444.4s] very disenfranchised myself. We ended our relationship together. I moved to another
[444.4s - 448.7s] franchise partner for a year and I realized it wasn't about the brick and the mortar.
[449.0s - 452.8s] It was always about the people. It was always about the culture. And then I had a conversation
[452.8s - 457.7s] with a franchise broker to figure out what I wanted to do when I grew up. And so that
[457.7s - 464.3s] was in my early 40s at this point. And they pitched peer board executive review type of
[464.3s - 470.0s] franchises. And back then, if you had a coach, what was wrong with you? And now if you don't
[470.0s - 473.2s] have a coach, what's wrong with you? Because everybody's going to coach right? I've got a life
[473.2s - 477.0s] coach. I've got a business coach. I've got a health coach. You know, so I was like, wow,
[477.0s - 484.3s] people make money at that. And that's how I got into I purchased a franchise, sold a franchise
[484.3s - 488.9s] a year later and then birthed and recreated what I have now. And I was in a conversation
[488.9s - 495.8s] with my business coach back then. And we were doing an unpacking strategy day. And she
[495.8s - 500.2s] said, OK, I get it. I've looked at your website. You know, I understand your history, your
[500.2s - 505.1s] experiences. So you're really about culture and the environment. And it was the first time
[505.1s - 512.1s] those words had really hit me. And I was like, yes, that is what I do. And so that became
[512.1s - 517.2s] and that's when my tagline culture matters actually, you know, came into play. So that
[517.2s - 522.1s] was the that's the long answer to your to your question. I got there, but I have lived
[522.7s - 528.2s] those culture toxic environments. And I've lived the great environments and the ones on the
[528.2s - 535.8s] in between. And I have three kids and they're all adults now. And I don't want them. And
[535.8s - 540.7s] I nor do I think that people should work in environments that just don't match them.
[540.7s - 546.2s] I think there's a better way. There's a lot of companies, a lot of industries, a lot of
[546.2s - 552.1s] verticals that have different types of culture, doing the same types of job. And you just need
[552.1s - 557.5s] to find what is it you like to do inside the culture that, you know, fits who you are. And
[557.5s - 563.7s] then work isn't so working, you know, it's not so horrible. I started coaching somebody
[563.7s - 569.7s] the other day who one of their goals was I want to like right now, we like 25% of my
[569.7s - 575.5s] job. And by the end of 26, I want to like at least half of my job. And I was like, oh, it
[575.5s - 580.5s] shouldn't be like that. You should like most of your job, right? Even if it's multiple things
[580.5s - 586.2s] you're doing. And I've heard, of course, the stories from my kids working for other people as well.
[586.2s - 589.8s] And it's just, I know there's a better way. I know there is. So.
[590.7s - 595.4s] God, I got to know that's that that helps a lot. I mean, I've seen that, you know, I mean,
[595.4s - 601.5s] you almost like kind of coined the word like, you know, culture curator. Yeah. Oh, I did
[601.5s - 607.0s] point that I did. That's me. I should have trademarked it. I should have trademarked culture matters
[607.5s - 612.2s] because now, you know, everybody, everything is a matters now. And I should have trademarked
[613.0s - 624.9s] the culture curator, which I did in my certification and the dehydration my last book. I've
[624.9s - 628.7s] said pretty, you know, interesting word like, well, like, you know, curator, what's, like,
[628.8s - 633.8s] why do you pick that one specific that word? Yeah. I, you know what? Nobody has ever asked me that
[633.8s - 640.1s] before. So I appreciate that. When you curate something, you are to me, you're living and breathing
[640.1s - 646.5s] inside of that and you're protecting it. So one of my parts of my model, the whole curation is
[646.5s - 653.5s] you're analyzing and detecting first. And then you go into that creating and restoration of it.
[653.5s - 660.1s] And then finally, you curate it and you tend to it. So the ultimate is the curation. It is the
[660.1s - 666.8s] protecting of not only the manifestation of, but the living and breathing to make sure that it stays
[666.8s - 673.3s] hydrated to make sure the droplets are happening in multiple ways every single day. And that people
[673.3s - 679.1s] feel a part of and that it's a living breathing because our, whether there's two people or 14,000
[679.7s - 685.6s] there are cultures and those are living, breathing ecosystems that we don't always recognize that way.
[685.8s - 692.1s] And so that's why I used curator. Wow. That makes a lot of sense for me to explain like that.
[693.7s - 699.7s] And it's, um, do you feel like, um, like, you know, like, it's like, it's like, it's like,
[699.7s - 705.8s] the expression almost feels like there's like a force if you don't do that. There's a force that
[705.8s - 711.6s] pulls it to the opposite of that, right? Opposite of what you want, which is why I would assume a lot
[711.6s - 717.7s] of workplaces nowadays, you know, like, like, like, you're giving an example. Most people would not say
[717.7s - 723.4s] most of their day is what they enjoy, right? They might enjoy like 10, 20% of that if that.
[726.7s - 731.2s] So, I mean, okay, do you, like, I guess my question on with that line was,
[731.2s - 738.4s] um, do you feel like, like, companies need somebody from like internally, like, who's going to be
[738.4s - 743.9s] responsible for this? Or they can, the help is out there. Um, you know, like, like, like, it's becoming
[743.9s - 748.2s] more of a thing that, um, you know, people are basically realizing, like, you know, it's not something
[748.2s - 752.0s] that you just pulled those through for like, you know, a couple of decades. It should be something
[752.0s - 756.8s] that's more tolerable and maybe even enjoyable. Um, since that's becoming more important,
[756.8s - 761.3s] and society's waking up to that, what, where, how do you see, like, them getting help? Like, is it,
[761.3s - 765.7s] like, hey, I think eventually everybody will have a role that, that this person is like, you know,
[765.7s - 769.8s] that's what they do. Or is it more like, no, you, you bring that person in from outside because
[769.8s - 776.9s] they can see the fresh eyes, et cetera. It's, it's all of that, um, you know, my company helps people
[776.9s - 782.8s] do that. And it can be a heavy lift or a light lift. But ultimately, whenever, you know,
[782.8s - 790.9s] because I'm a consulting group, so whenever that engagement ends or starts to, um, uh, back off,
[790.9s - 797.1s] if you will, the key is empowering the entire team to curate their culture. So it does typically
[797.1s - 802.1s] start with a person or a handful of people that understand the need for that. And they'll either
[802.1s - 807.1s] go through the certification with me. They'll have me, usually it's that I come in and I do a
[807.1s - 812.2s] culture inquiry. I take that, I detect what's happening. And then from there, we come up with a
[812.2s - 818.6s] game plan in order to restore it. So sometimes, uh, it is, is an individual who starts it and understands
[818.6s - 824.6s] that there's a better way and understands that we needed to find who we are and, and I, I, I say,
[824.7s - 830.1s] culture is, um, how we do what we do when we work together. And so what does that mean around the
[830.1s - 835.5s] mission vision values and how is that aligned? So it's not one thing. It's multiple things.
[835.5s - 842.8s] Curation takes day to day tending. It can't be one person's shoulder, one department, one leader,
[843.5s - 848.5s] even if the leaders at the, at the top, everybody has to start having that, that protection,
[848.9s - 855.4s] that tending to mindset. Because if not, you'll end up with blind spots and pockets of dehydration.
[855.7s - 860.3s] And then, follow you have, you know, complete. It's, if you think about it from a gardening
[860.3s - 866.2s] perspective, you know, farming, and you have the field, your entire team, your tools, your systems,
[867.0s - 873.9s] you, it starts with tending to one of the plants that hopefully will seed and bleed into the others.
[874.3s - 881.7s] But the same is very true from a negative contagion. When one section of a plant in a field is sick,
[882.1s - 887.8s] it moves into the rest of the field pretty quickly. So it's easier to infiltrate the negative
[887.8s - 894.3s] contagion than the positive contagion. And so I talk about that through leading indicators versus
[894.3s - 899.9s] lagging indicators. The lagging when we're tending to our plants is when we start to see the plant
[899.9s - 907.2s] ground or this will, it starts to get dry and crusty. That's a lagging indicator. The curation part
[907.2s - 913.9s] is to get ahead of that as a leading indicator that I know this plant requires this amount of
[914.5s - 921.0s] fertilization and hydration and droplets as we go. The same as us as human beings. Some of
[921.0s - 926.9s] us need more one-on-one contact daily to check in and conversate. Some of us need more big picture.
[927.2s - 931.8s] Some of us need the details. Some of us could care less about the details. And the list goes on.
[932.3s - 940.3s] So curating that isn't one thing that's multiple thing. And so the answer is it takes ultimately for a
[941.6s - 947.6s] healthy environment ecosystem culture. Multiple people get their role as a curator.
[948.3s - 953.7s] But yes, that's often how I'm brought in is we think we're good. We need to see if we're good.
[954.0s - 960.8s] What would better be? I have more people who understand and get it from the get-go than the ones
[960.8s - 968.2s] that are toxic and end up in the headlines. They are usually the last to call if at all and they
[968.2s - 975.8s] think they can fix it on their own. Correct. That makes sense. For the going with that analogy with
[976.7s - 983.8s] flowers, browning, if lagging indicators are like let's say people are having arguments, people
[983.8s - 990.2s] are really basically depressed at the company, stuff like that. What would be some leading
[990.2s - 995.8s] indicators in a company? No, that's a great question. So leading indicators are maybe people
[995.8s - 1004.0s] used to offer up their opinions and meetings. Maybe they used to say what can we do or what we're
[1004.0s - 1010.7s] doing? They start to say that they, the them. It's the us versus them. We first start to show up in
[1010.7s - 1015.9s] our body language and then we start to verbalize it. It could be the company that does a lot of
[1015.9s - 1021.3s] things on teams call. They have a hybrid environment or a fully remote environment. People used to
[1021.3s - 1026.4s] have their videos on. Now they don't. It used to be people always hit deadlines. Now they don't.
[1027.0s - 1032.4s] We used to conversate in the elevator. Now we don't. So those are, those are, you know, the water
[1032.4s - 1036.9s] cooler talk, the hallway chat, the when we come in in the morning, popping in the other's offices,
[1037.0s - 1043.4s] meeting, you know, the breaker and now we don't. The morning messaging in route to maybe talk about
[1043.4s - 1048.9s] what we're going to do for the day when we're in our car or on teams or messages on and now we don't.
[1049.5s - 1056.1s] Those don't just turn off overnight. It's not a water spiket. It starts to, and unfortunately,
[1056.5s - 1061.4s] had this conversation with somebody yesterday, actually in a LinkedIn post. I'd written an article
[1062.1s - 1070.1s] and the bottom line is the people usually see those leading indicators are the entry level or
[1070.1s - 1076.7s] the doers of the day, the taskmasters of the day, maybe middle management. The last people to see
[1076.7s - 1082.5s] it is usually the executive and the leadership team. And bet everybody else has already seen it.
[1082.5s - 1089.0s] It's because oftentimes the leaders, the executive, the people managers get busy being busy. They're
[1089.0s - 1093.7s] in a lot of meetings. They're thinking strategy. They're checking off their list and they're not
[1093.7s - 1100.5s] checking in to what's happening when they send out a communication. What was their response?
[1100.8s - 1106.2s] What was the reaction? And we just, it's not often on purpose that we, we don't want to just wake
[1106.2s - 1110.8s] up and now we're not talking and paying attention that it happens, you know, a little bit over time.
[1111.6s - 1114.9s] So usually the team is seeing it before the leader is seeing it.
[1115.9s - 1121.5s] Quite a lot of that's really fascinating. That makes a lot of sense. As you're giving those examples,
[1121.8s - 1128.2s] like I think anybody watching what they would they would, I think, out hit them way more because it's
[1128.2s - 1134.2s] like people can feel that, right? Like they used to, you know, upbeat, you know, give their
[1134.2s - 1139.4s] opinions during discussions. Now they're just sitting it out, waiting for the time to pass.
[1140.2s - 1145.9s] And then if they do say something, it's more a little bit like blame going on versus like,
[1146.1s - 1151.6s] you know, everyone collectively taking our responsibilities. So that's really interesting. And would you say like
[1153.1s - 1157.0s] some people might think that this only applies to, let's say, like, you know, very large companies.
[1157.7s - 1163.3s] But is there like a third in size, you'd say, where like it starts really become important even then?
[1164.2s - 1168.5s] Well, the more it can apply whether, you know, again, when there's two people in the room,
[1168.5s - 1176.1s] where thousands of people inside of a company, it becomes longer to shift the restoration,
[1176.4s - 1183.5s] the tending that hydration, the more there are. So just purely because of, you know, the way that
[1183.5s - 1190.9s] aspect of that. And the quicker to move is the smaller groups, the larger just because of usually the
[1190.9s - 1197.4s] layers, the multiple locations, it does just purely by numbers. But the bigger thing is
[1198.2s - 1203.9s] the team getting and understanding the value of it because the culture's there, whether we call it the
[1203.9s - 1209.2s] culture or not, whether we focus on the culture or not, the culture's there and makes me crazy when
[1209.2s - 1214.3s] people say, well, we went to remote, you know, all things after post COVID, you know, we just don't
[1214.3s - 1220.2s] have a culture anymore. Oh, no, you have a culture. It just may not be what it was originally. But even
[1220.2s - 1226.9s] 100% remote teams absolutely have a culture. The culture again is how we do what we do when we work
[1226.9s - 1233.5s] together. So how do you message on team? What's the frequency video on video off? How are timelines
[1233.5s - 1238.9s] missed? How do we measure? How do we problem solve? How do we decision make? How do we collaborate?
[1239.3s - 1246.8s] How do we onboard? They're still all of that is a part of our of our culture. So easier for the
[1246.8s - 1253.5s] smaller because you've got small moving parts quicker, easier to get together, harder with the layers
[1253.5s - 1259.6s] and or leaders who are not on board. That makes sense for sure. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of people
[1259.6s - 1264.8s] then just like probably many things in business, it'll take a while for that to like those leaves turn
[1264.8s - 1274.9s] over. Yes, yes, absolutely. In terms of seeing, you know, companies where things, you know, are
[1274.9s - 1281.0s] do need a lot of tending or curating. You wrote a big you wrote a book about the, you know, how to
[1281.0s - 1286.1s] avoid culture big fat failures. So I was going to ask like, you know, in this whole time you've been
[1286.1s - 1292.9s] doing this, what would you say is like an example of one of the most like, you know, hardcore one where
[1292.9s - 1297.6s] you were just like shaking your head and you okay, you got your hands full. Which one would you say?
[1297.8s - 1303.6s] And not that you don't have to name the company, but like the way I won't name the company, but often
[1304.2s - 1310.1s] and still to instilled in this day. And I do, I do give a lot of examples in the in the book that
[1310.1s - 1316.4s] followed, which is the thirsty book the most recent one. But in both of those, I talk about the leader
[1318.2s - 1325.2s] sharing their, you know, we need to solve this problem asking for input and then very quickly
[1325.2s - 1330.9s] start talking again. They're not waiting for the responses. They're answering their own question
[1330.9s - 1335.8s] and they're wondering why they're the only ones talking in their meetings. I see that over and over
[1335.8s - 1342.9s] and over again. So like you're not either you don't have the patience or you don't have the desire
[1342.9s - 1348.8s] that you really want to hear other people's opinions. And, and the ones that kind of come at it,
[1348.9s - 1356.0s] I've been in a few cause with this recently is the sales team isn't selling. What's the problem?
[1356.0s - 1360.9s] What are you guys doing? Why aren't you selling? And they're just rapid fire. You're not doing,
[1361.0s - 1367.8s] you're not doing, you're not doing. Instead of, hey, sales of slows down, it's taking longer to close.
[1368.6s - 1375.3s] What are you seeing out there? What's working? What's not working? How do I help you? What do we need to do
[1375.3s - 1381.2s] differently? And I like to frame it in. I like, I wish I wonder. So it shifts the mindset and I
[1381.2s - 1387.8s] see that all the time and I have, I have my entire life in corporate America. I see that often.
[1388.0s - 1395.8s] When I'm asked in and the question is we don't have any engagement. Nobody shares opinions and I'll
[1395.8s - 1399.6s] come into a meeting. I'm like, yeah, they're not sharing opinions because you're not giving a
[1399.6s - 1404.6s] chance to and you don't really want their opinion. So I have to be the person to say, this is what I
[1404.6s - 1407.2s] witnessed during your meeting. You're the problem.
[1409.5s - 1416.9s] Core, core, excellent. Yeah. It's like, it's like, I like the sales examples specifically because
[1416.9s - 1421.8s] that's one I've actually experienced myself where it's about like, you know, where we felt
[1421.8s - 1426.5s] short in the quarter. I had like, you know, multiple sales jobs before I had my own business. So,
[1426.8s - 1432.8s] you know, rarely, well, I can't remember even a single time. It was asked like, hey, like, you know,
[1432.8s - 1437.1s] it's like, what's going on? I mean, you're on the field for like, what's going on, right?
[1438.7s - 1443.8s] That's that's if they if they were asked at least, you know, people at the least would feel
[1443.8s - 1448.8s] some kind of like, you know, like, okay, they care. And at the most, it'll probably be more. They
[1448.8s - 1453.0s] would probably get data that could help them, you know, coach the entire team better.
[1453.6s - 1459.6s] Yes, absolutely. And then the second mistake, based on what you just said, is that they may stop
[1459.6s - 1464.9s] and do the pause. And then the person says, this is what I'm hearing in the field or the group is
[1464.9s - 1469.4s] saying, this is what we're hearing. And then the leader dismisses it. No, that's not right. No,
[1469.5s - 1474.8s] that's not true. You know, no, that's BS. No, that can't be real. And they dismiss what it said. So,
[1475.3s - 1479.7s] what's going to happen the next time the leader asks, cricket again, I'm not going to tell you what
[1479.7s - 1485.6s] I'm hearing because you dismiss me. You may have embarrassed me, made me feel silly, stupid, small.
[1486.2s - 1491.7s] I'm not going to give you my opinion again. You'll thank you. So that's that, you know, second
[1491.7s - 1498.7s] often misdebted. That's a... Cousin of the first mistake, basically. Yes. Yes, that's a great way to say it.
[1499.0s - 1506.2s] I like that. Yes. Yes. The ugly cousin. Yeah. Whatever. Even if you do ask, but you have your
[1506.2s - 1511.0s] preconceived, like, you know, opinions about whatever. And then you give it fire right back. And
[1511.0s - 1516.6s] then probably just feel like, why did I even raise my hand? Like, it's exactly. And that is so
[1516.6s - 1525.1s] common, unfortunately. Yeah. Got it, got it. And also another thing that, like, while you're explaining
[1525.1s - 1533.2s] that, like, I just, my mind went here. It's a Lex Friedman podcast. Jeff, Jeff Bezos was saying that
[1533.2s - 1539.9s] he tries to just be at the very back and be very quiet and let everybody speak until he speaks and
[1539.9s - 1544.9s] gets his opinion. Because he has seen that if he speaks, you know, he's a rascal first.
[1548.5s - 1554.3s] Sorry. A lot of times then, you know, like, like, he gets his opinion that nobody else would
[1554.3s - 1559.6s] talk. But, you know, so if he can do it at that level and just be quiet until everybody speaks,
[1559.8s - 1566.6s] that means nobody's really like above it, so to speak. Correct. 100%. Yeah. That is the great example
[1566.6s - 1573.3s] of what to do because you want, you want it to be free flowing, right? And then you're able to
[1573.3s - 1580.2s] out as the leader to be able to pull back and say, great dialogue. This is what I heard. These are
[1580.2s - 1585.4s] the nuggets that I'm taking away. This is what I'm thinking. You know, this is what I'm processing.
[1586.3s - 1592.3s] Or I love that idea. Let's flesh that out and absolutely that's, that's the best way to do it.
[1592.3s - 1597.4s] It's the best way to do it. Because then you're really listening. Yeah. You take your whole time and
[1597.4s - 1603.0s] then you can, that's that's a lot of, um, any leaders who get this information they could learn from
[1603.0s - 1610.9s] that. Um, shifting to some very special type of, um, experiences you have in terms of like, um,
[1611.6s - 1618.7s] there's, um, I would say, like, you know, in the world of leadership, um, military is a very,
[1618.7s - 1623.5s] um, you know, unique one, I would say, even, um, I wasn't in the military, but I know from
[1623.5s - 1628.8s] movies and stuff, like, you know, they definitely have, um, a level of getting everybody to the same thing.
[1629.1s - 1635.6s] So, uh, you were, you know, you worked with, uh, mission 6-0, uh, the honor foundation. So I was
[1635.6s - 1641.1s] gonna ask, like, you know, working with elite, like military operators, uh, what, what did that
[1641.1s - 1647.4s] teach you about leadership that you didn't really see incorporate? That's it. Uh, the, the military,
[1647.4s - 1654.0s] I mean, every military and every, you know, company has its pros and cons and you'll, you'll hear
[1654.0s - 1659.4s] the special ops, uh, folks say that as well and people who've been in the military for a short time
[1659.4s - 1664.6s] or a long time. So they have there, but they are known for their structure. They're known for their
[1664.6s - 1670.0s] discipline. Um, and they're not just known for it, they live it and breathe it, especially those
[1670.0s - 1680.1s] individuals have been in 10, 20, uh, plus years. So the difference is often the reporting that my,
[1680.3s - 1687.0s] my captain said, my admiral said, the, the general said, the platoon leader said, and therefore I'm
[1687.0s - 1693.3s] gonna do it and I'm gonna follow. That's not automatic in corporate America, just because my boss
[1693.3s - 1698.8s] said it doesn't mean I'm absolutely gonna do it. And so that becomes the biggest when people are
[1698.8s - 1703.8s] shifting out of the military into corporate and especially if they went in when they were 17, 18
[1703.8s - 1710.9s] years old and they didn't have those other experiences. That is often shocking that why would you not
[1710.9s - 1717.5s] do with your boss asking you to do? Because in their formative years, of course, you know, my, the
[1717.5s - 1721.5s] chain of command, I'm gonna follow it and if they said to do it, I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna do it.
[1721.6s - 1727.0s] I'm not talking about things that were breaking ethics and breaking morals. Let's set that aside.
[1727.0s - 1734.1s] It just mean fundamentally, you know, the tasks. So the discipline that, especially those, I started
[1734.1s - 1739.5s] working with the Honor Foundation as a coach years ago and those were all initially that went
[1739.5s - 1747.5s] through the transition, all special ops. And so that, that caliber of discipline and purpose driven
[1748.4s - 1756.6s] the protection of the collaboration of the unit is just unlike anything I've ever seen your
[1756.6s - 1763.3s] experience. It's just, it's amazing. It's amazing the tightness of the unit and how they truly have
[1763.3s - 1772.3s] each other's backs have their six. And to me, that is just undeniably amazing, you know, for those
[1772.3s - 1780.3s] that are called to serve to, to that magnitude, mad respect isn't, isn't understatement because
[1780.3s - 1786.7s] that is a calling and for those that stay in adds to the discipline. It adds to, you know, all those
[1786.7s - 1792.4s] pieces, regardless of whether you internet going into the special operations side or not, you know,
[1792.5s - 1796.5s] we stay in as well. So, but the difference, I think, is that it's not to say that corporate
[1796.5s - 1802.0s] America cannot also be disciplined, but the fabric in which we were, you know, how
[1803.2s - 1809.0s] what we were predicated on is just different fundamentally in a lot of ways. And I love
[1810.3s - 1816.2s] marrying people inside of companies that have been in 20 years into the military and bringing them
[1816.2s - 1820.8s] in because they just bring a whole other skill set. It's often, it's often missed because either
[1820.8s - 1826.7s] they can't translate what they did outside of military speak into corporate America speak or the
[1826.7s - 1832.8s] corporate America cannot grasp, you know, you were in the military for 20 years and, you know, you
[1832.8s - 1838.2s] were in charge of transportation. How does that like, you don't have any experience doing and
[1838.2s - 1843.7s] leading? Are you nuts? They have way more experience than most of the applicants that you come in.
[1847.5s - 1854.2s] You called her the brass ovaries on yours. Title alone feels like there's a whole story
[1854.2s - 1861.0s] pending. Yeah. That was a side project, but I'll let you ask your question. My question was,
[1861.5s - 1866.2s] what made you, you know, want to be a part of that kind of project, you know, specifically for
[1866.2s - 1872.6s] like with women in leadership? Yeah. Yeah. So I want to clarify, it's not a male bashing book in
[1872.6s - 1877.8s] any way, shape or form. Just so for anybody who is like, oh my gosh, she's, she's don't, don't label
[1877.8s - 1883.7s] me. It's not that. It really is an empowerment piece. I'm passionate about helping people
[1883.7s - 1888.5s] and meeting them where they are. I'm definitely passionate on the women's side because when I did
[1888.5s - 1893.9s] go out of my own, even though I had those formative years, from my, you know, from my parents,
[1893.9s - 1900.3s] I didn't have a network that had been there, done that that I could call on. Women just
[1900.3s - 1904.8s] historically have not had that because we don't, we don't typically come in with a business
[1904.8s - 1911.4s] acumen. If I'm talking just centuries of lineage, we just don't have, you know, have that exposure.
[1911.7s - 1918.4s] And so that book was meant to give the pockets of the things that we are inside of our head
[1918.4s - 1923.7s] because just like generations are different, genders are different as well. And of course,
[1923.8s - 1930.7s] we're all different based on our life experiences. But just trying to meet a woman in, in the way that,
[1930.9s - 1935.5s] you know, I've got you, I've been there, I've done that. At the end of each chapter, we've got
[1935.5s - 1942.7s] cleaning the closet. So it's actionable to, to turn it into how do I get outside of my own head?
[1942.7s - 1947.2s] You know, we've, we've got cute titles in there about, you know, lobsters in the tank,
[1947.2s - 1951.5s] you know, not letting other, other people bring you down. An example would be,
[1952.7s - 1960.3s] in my early years, I've always been very work focused. And I had three young kids, but I was
[1960.3s - 1965.9s] still very work focused. So that, that balance. And for the mothers that were stay at home mothers,
[1966.1s - 1971.2s] and here I was working, and I was an executive, I always felt like the outsider, and always felt
[1971.2s - 1977.3s] like a bad parent. And my kids are amazing. I, I don't feel like a bad parent, but you, you have
[1977.3s - 1981.9s] that guilt in it. You know, so we've got some fun little stories and takes in there. And then there's
[1981.9s - 1989.1s] chapters that are dedicated by other women that we brought in and you hear their story as well. And
[1989.1s - 1996.4s] one of them was a massive Mary Kay representative, always in the million dollar club for years. And
[1996.4s - 2001.0s] her husband never wanted to work. And so you hear that story. You hear another one talk about
[2001.0s - 2007.3s] growing up in a single home with her own or mom in a trailer park and what that was like. And
[2007.3s - 2012.8s] now she's got multiple businesses and multi-millionaire. And so here you hear the stories and the
[2012.8s - 2019.3s] struggles. And she has, she has a child as well. And it's also single. So you hear, and so it's meant to
[2020.8s - 2027.2s] the play on the words obviously, brass ovaries, meaning women. But the brass and owning yours is
[2027.2s - 2032.5s] the really the call of whether you're a man or woman, own who you are, love who you are,
[2033.3s - 2040.5s] be who you are, find your people, understand your why, and, and make an impact in this thing called
[2040.5s - 2045.1s] life and make sure you pass that along. That's what the intended message was to be.
[2046.5s - 2052.0s] Wow, that's powerful. Thank you. I feel like that's a really great place to stop.
[2053.0s - 2059.9s] That the last message was really hard hitting. So we actually have another
[2060.9s - 2068.3s] session to the call here. And this part can sometimes go in the end if it, if it, you know,
[2068.3s - 2075.2s] all sounds good. But basically what we do with our guests is you could call it a roast, but it like,
[2075.3s - 2079.6s] like, we give you permission to if you want to. But basically we kind of show you what we have
[2079.6s - 2084.6s] going on. And we ask for advice like for a, you know, company that's relatively new, you know,
[2084.7s - 2090.4s] what would you say, like, like it means. So let me pull that up. Sure.
[2095.3s - 2100.4s] And I do have a hard stop at 11 just so you know, for actually another podcast.
[2101.4s - 2106.5s] Okay, of course. Yeah, I think we'll be wrapping up in an extra few minutes. Actually,
[2106.5s - 2110.1s] yeah, in that case, I'll just play this because sometimes when I try to explain what we do in
[2110.1s - 2113.2s] taking like 10 minutes, I'll just share my real quick.
[2120.6s - 2125.9s] Can you see it? It has started to come up. I see the, there we go.
[2126.6s - 2129.1s] Okay, I'll just play this little video. This is my partner Ash.
[2129.7s - 2130.1s] Okay.
[2132.1s - 2133.4s] Can't hear him. There we go.
[2138.4s - 2139.8s] I don't hear anything.
[2144.7s - 2152.0s] I see it, but I don't hear it. Can you hear me? Yeah, a little bit.
[2153.0s - 2157.3s] I can't hear anything. I see it. I see him talking, but if there's sound.
[2157.5s - 2161.2s] Oh, I'm here. Um, that's weird.
[2164.7s - 2168.9s] Maybe it's something on the, I'll just I'll just narrate it basically.
[2169.6s - 2173.0s] Basically, what we do is like, I think it's below is better here.
[2173.4s - 2179.2s] Like we work with like, you know, like basically businesses who want to be,
[2180.2s - 2184.7s] you know, build their social media and their YouTube presence more, basically become like a leader,
[2185.5s - 2190.8s] you know, in their own space and get a lot of views and you know, get their message across
[2190.8s - 2195.9s] build their YouTube channel to be large, right? So our whole strategy is like, you know,
[2196.0s - 2199.6s] how we're a little bit different than like normal traditional video editing agencies is that,
[2200.1s - 2206.9s] you know, we reach out on behalf of them on like the highest like level businesses that they want
[2206.9s - 2211.4s] to work with. You rate that list and get them to come on their business as like, you know,
[2211.6s - 2216.5s] podcast host. I mean, I mean, guests, right? And then we do all editing and stuff and make them
[2216.5s - 2222.8s] go up on social media like that 200 pros, right? So you're the behind the scenes, you're the logistics
[2222.8s - 2229.6s] person and okay, go ahead. Exactly. That's exactly it, right? So the our whole, you know, one of
[2229.6s - 2233.6s] the things we also say that we are proud of tracking is we tell them like, you know, the whole thing
[2233.6s - 2238.2s] takes three to four hours of the owner's time because all they got to do is show up on the call
[2238.2s - 2243.0s] and they have guests coming. But everything before that takes the hard work to get the guests to come,
[2243.0s - 2247.9s] be scheduling, you know, all that kind of stuff if it needs, along with editing and posting everywhere
[2247.9s - 2253.6s] and all the strategy that comes with that, everything is taking care, right? So I guess with that
[2253.6s - 2259.5s] kind of thing, what are your thoughts? No, I think it's a great idea. I had two podcasts prior
[2260.3s - 2265.5s] and one of them's got almost 600 episodes and it was just me, I called it the morning commute.
[2266.0s - 2271.2s] It was meant to be a five, ten minute snippet of, you know, idea called the action for the day.
[2271.2s - 2277.3s] And then the culture hour, which is where I would, you know, have guests do this. And that was
[2277.3s - 2283.6s] before I had some additional team members and yes, it's very exhaustive. And, you know, I had some
[2284.1s - 2288.2s] fellowship and enbuyers, but it didn't do what I, you know, what I wanted it to do for your,
[2288.6s - 2292.9s] because it's labor intensive for people who don't know how to edit and who don't know.
[2293.1s - 2299.8s] Correct. You know, now I do have a few, somebody specifically who does the Riverside and does some
[2299.8s - 2304.2s] editing for client clips and things that they do on LinkedIn, but it is time consuming to your
[2304.2s - 2310.9s] point. So I know podcasts are hot to obviously YouTube, YouTube TV is hot. So I definitely think
[2310.9s - 2316.4s] there's value in that. It's the, it's the, it's the matter of, I don't think me finding guests
[2316.4s - 2323.7s] is difficult either. I mean, I can put a call out on LinkedIn and do a post or get on. I participate
[2323.7s - 2329.1s] in Harrow, help a reporter out and quote an SOS or sources of sources. So I could do a post
[2329.1s - 2334.7s] and get a plethora of people, you know, to say that they want to come on, but then it's to your
[2334.7s - 2339.2s] point, the scheduling and the editing. So really it comes down to, do I think it's great? Do I
[2339.2s - 2345.9s] think it works? Yes. How much money does it take in order to do that? And every social post, as
[2345.9s - 2351.8s] you very well know, just like what you're doing right now is to grow your business. And so if we
[2351.8s - 2359.3s] all could figure out the magic to do that, we would, you know, all be doing it. So it's not that
[2359.3s - 2364.9s] I'm not open to it. I like I said, I've been there done that before. It comes down to what is your
[2364.9s - 2370.9s] fee? What are your kind of your stats? How long have you guys been doing this to be able to go,
[2370.9s - 2375.0s] okay, yeah, that makes sense. I want to try that. Yeah, I actually do want to try that with you guys.
[2375.1s - 2379.4s] Does that make sense? That makes sense. That makes sense. Yeah. A lot of episodes.
[2379.9s - 2384.8s] Yeah, I see that in the viewership. You know, what is the viewership is what I would want to know?
[2384.8s - 2389.5s] What's the average view per? And then, you know, talking to the people that you're working with,
[2389.6s - 2395.2s] have they actually gotten business out of it? Because it is fun to do. And it is great. It does set
[2395.2s - 2400.9s] you up as a thought leader, which is what we're looking for, right? You want people to be top of mind,
[2400.9s - 2409.0s] but it comes down to is the effort of your time and the billable, you know,
[2409.1s - 2413.6s] invoice is a given you what you need and how long before you actually see that. There's no
[2414.2s - 2419.7s] guarantees of any of that. We all know that. Right, right, normal for sure. That makes a lot of sense.
[2420.0s - 2426.6s] For in your industry, right? If like, you know, company like us was to be able to get customers
[2426.6s - 2433.7s] and grow them like basic other companies that help companies with culture. Right? And we want to get
[2433.7s - 2439.7s] them more. What would you say is like a good way to like you were saying, you know, like when it comes
[2439.7s - 2445.0s] down to is what we charge in our case, it's $2,000 a month, we charge, or then we get about like 12
[2445.0s - 2452.0s] podcasts, 10 to 12 podcasts a month. But as you're saying, like, what would be a way that would
[2452.0s - 2458.7s] make it like no brainer? Is it like, hey, they, they, our previous one got this new views or?
[2459.6s - 2464.5s] Well, it starts with the views because if you're not getting used, then the likelihood of, you know,
[2464.7s - 2469.8s] being found, but you could have one view and it could be the right person too. So I mean, I know
[2469.8s - 2476.6s] that as well, but it does start with the viewership and the exposure for the likelihood. But getting
[2476.6s - 2483.1s] a client per month out of that would, would be the bare minimum return that would have to happen
[2483.1s - 2489.2s] because if not, why it's, it becomes egotistical quite frankly to go, oh, I've got this minute,
[2489.3s - 2493.7s] you know, I've got these podcasts. Well, that's great. But I'm trying to paint my bills, you know what I mean?
[2494.2s - 2499.4s] Yeah, which some, you know, some people that's fine. I mean, if I became an influencer out of it,
[2499.8s - 2504.0s] the bills would be getting paid because you're getting the sponsors out of it, which is,
[2504.0s - 2509.2s] you know, the same thing as what we would call it, you know, a client piece. So that would be my answer.
[2509.6s - 2516.8s] It's predicated on, yeah, I think use initially to, um, to see if it's worth the risk. But
[2516.8s - 2521.4s] at the end of the day, if 3000 is put out and nothing has gotten back, then
[2522.1s - 2527.4s] right, if not actually a tangible client was not sold, then it makes less sense.
[2527.7s - 2531.8s] It doesn't make sense. It's not good. It's not a good business practice to do that. So like,
[2531.8s - 2535.9s] go into the grocery store and fill in your refrigerator up every week and not eating any of it.
[2536.5s - 2538.2s] Right. Why would you do that?
[2539.9s - 2545.2s] For sure, for sure. No, thanks a lot of sense. Yeah. Awesome. Well, Shale, thank you so much for coming
[2545.2s - 2548.8s] on the show. I know you have one other call coming up. So don't want to keep you any much longer.
[2549.5s - 2557.0s] So what, what is the next steps, meaning next steps for the outcome of this? When do you post? How do
[2557.0s - 2562.6s] you post? Where do you post? And then over additional information on your services as well.
[2563.3s - 2568.0s] For sure, definitely. Yeah, thank you for asking for that. Yeah. So the, um, we're posting,
[2568.1s - 2574.2s] I believe sometime in April, because we have a, like, like, quite a few shows lined up. Yeah,
[2574.4s - 2578.4s] that's what we've worked through. So the ones that we're shooting this week is going up like
[2578.4s - 2585.5s] sometime, um, mid to end of April. Um, and then in terms of the second, when you said, yeah,
[2585.5s - 2590.3s] be happy to all send you an email with, you know, our work and some examples we have. And, um,
[2590.5s - 2593.6s] you know, there'll be our case studies and, you know, how much we grew them by and stuff like that.
[2593.6s - 2600.4s] And you can take a look. Okay. Very good. And you'll send me over when you post it. Where do you post it?
[2600.5s - 2605.1s] Is it YouTube only or how do, how will I know that it's gone live so I can share it?
[2606.2s - 2610.9s] Yeah, for sure. We're going to send you a link, um, with, uh, with the YouTube for the big one.
[2610.9s - 2616.4s] And a lot of times what we do do is take the, you know, viral clips, like the main hits and put it
[2616.4s - 2622.0s] some other places. Uh, those are the ones that I'll, uh, some of our, um, you know, like, um,
[2622.4s - 2626.0s] people come on the podcast. That's the ones they like to share. We'll probably share, um,
[2626.2s - 2629.6s] both with you. And then you can choose which one you'd like to share on anything you have.
[2630.2s - 2635.2s] Okay. Well, I definitely, uh, want to share it. So I'll make a note that if I haven't seen anything,
[2635.2s - 2641.9s] uh, by the end of April of, I'll follow up then. For sure. It was a waste of everybody's time.
[2641.9s - 2649.9s] And we don't want that. Yeah. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.